Kolkata:
The Principal of La Martiniere School for Boys spoke exclusively to NDTV's Monideepa Banerjee about the suicide of one of his students, Rouvan Rawla. 12-year-old Rouvan was found hanging at his house in Kolkata on February 12, four days after he was caned. Sunirmal Chakravarthi, the Principal, admits to caning Rouvan, but says that linking it to the child's death is "stretching it."
Here is the transcript of Chakravathi's interview to NDTV.
NDTV: For the first time since the death of Rouvan Rawla on February12, the Principal of La Martiniere Boys, is speaking to the media. The principal and three, maybe four teachers of the school, now have a case filed against them. The police have acquitted them of abetting Rovan suicide. Mr Chakravarty, thank you so much for speaking to us. Just to go back on the 12th, what did you rebuke Rouvanjit for?
Principal: Well I would like to change that word ... I did not rebuke him... he was guilty of bringing and setting off stink bombs in the class before the teacher arrived, and was again attempting to do so when the teacher was teaching. He was told in very clear terms that he would have to take a note signed by the Middle School Head asking his father to see me on Monday the 15th.
NDTV: Four days before that, on February 8, you caned Rouvan. Why was that? And is it true that the cane broke on his back?
Principal: What is true is that on Monday the 8th, I caned not just Rouvan but two other boys who were playing throughout and it is true that I used two mild strokes of cane. Two mild strokes. It is a horrendous and outrageous lie to say that the cane broke. That is a figment of I don't know whose imagination.
NDTV: Is it not something that you have admitted to in conversation with Ajay Rawla, the father?
Principal: What I have said is that it is an old cane which is frayed at the edges. That is what I have said. I have not said that the cane broke into two pieces. Now it is alleged that it broke into several pieces and that is wrong.
NDTV: That brings us to the whole principle of caning and corporal punishment. Is it true that caning is rampant in school? Where do you stand on corporal punishment?
Principal: There are two issues involved here - to say that caning is rampant in La Martiniere School is not correct. I am very clear with my teachers that nobody should hit them. If I have ever caned a guy, I have done it on the rarest of occasions and it has been mild caning to tell them clearly how disappointed the Principal is. They have never ever been caned with an intention to hurt. La Mart firmly believes that we need to correct children and we need to punish them in a fair manner, in a compassionate way. Now the second part of the question about where I stand in relation to corporal punishment, I have to admit that when I caned this boy I made a mistake and I am willing and ready to face the consequences of that. But to link this particularly with the caning that happened on Monday the 8th with the death of the boy four to five days later, I think is stretching it a bit.
NDTV: This is the first time that you admit that it was a mistake to cane Rouvanjit. Why are you saying that now?
Principal: I am surprised that you are saying that this is the first time. I have been questioned by my Board and I have said that to my Board. I don't think that I am answerable to anybody else. Not only have I admitted it to the Board, I have apologized for my mistake and I have been rapped on my knuckles for that. Now what?
NDTV: But why do you think it's a mistake? You clearly don't think that a corrective action is necessary.
Principal: Corrective action is necessary but now as I am being told, day in and day out, that caning is not a correct form of punishment. Then I have to admit that it was a mistake.
NDTV: So were you not aware that caning is now illegal?
Principal: I knew that caning was not approved of and was illegal but I must admit I wasn't too sure of that. But I am aware now that it was wrong.
NDTV:So are you saying that from now on there will be no more caning in La Martiniere?
Principal: Maa'm all I can say to you is that I have received an admonition from the Board and I have given not only my apologies for what has happened but I have also very clearly stated that this will not be repeated. And as far as the cane is concerned, it is in the school archives now.
NDTV: And that must come as very good news for the La Martiniere boys. But in the meanwhile, you have a police case that charges you and 4 other teachers of abetting Rouvan for suicide. How do you handle that?
Principal: See Maa'm, the allegations have been made and they have to be proven. There has to be a connection between what happened on Monday and what happened on Tuesday. I deny that there is any truth in this but it is for the concerned authorities and departments to find any link. As far as I am concerned, there was no link.
NDTV: Finally, one thing that Ajay Rawla has said is that ever since Rouvan's death, he has written to the Board and he has tried to get some response it but there hasn't been any. And you have told us about the apology to the Board but have you ever thought about apologising to the father of the boy?
Principal: If I have to apologise to Mr Rawla I would do it but why would I do so? (for caning his son).
NDTV: Would you consider an apology to Mr Ajay Rawla?
Principal: It is being said that none of us called the family after the death, but on the day of the chautha, when the memorial was being held in the house, my Vice Principal, my Head of Juniors, my Head of Middle Section and myself, we all went to the family and offered our condolences to the family. We grieved with them and on the following day, during the Junior Sports Meet, we observed two minute silence. On Monday, we held a memorial service for him in school because he was so close to us. We did what was never done for any other boy in school. So are we grieving? Are we sorry for this death? Of course we are but I am actually mystified about what has caused this? What is it that made Rouvan to do what he did??
NDTV: Are you sure it was not the caning and humiliation by you or 3 or 4 other teachers?
Principal: Maa'm there is no case for humiliation and I and don't think that the caning which took place 4 days ago can be connected to this. And if a boy sets off a stink bomb is the class, you tell me what is a teacher expected to do? This teacher did the right thing, which is to go and report to the Middle Section. The Middle Section comes back, investigates, and interrogates the boys. So, where is the humiliation? Now, if the other boys point fingers at him and if that is what is regarded as humiliation, I wouldn't know. Is that what is being suggested? Because there was no humiliation.
NDTV: The boy was kept out of class for days on end, some say he was being slapped. All this put together -, not just between 8th of February and 12th of February, not just what you did- are you investigating all that? Are you looking into all that? Are you looking into the possibility that the boy, as it is claimed, was victimised?
Principal: Soon after Rouvan's death, the Bishop instituted a fact finding enquiry and this committee went into all the aspects of these allegations. Let me tell you when Mr Rawla met me, he introduced 2 new allegations - one is that his son was kept out of class for days and that Mr Gunyen had slapped his boy 2 or 3 years ago for whistling, which his son couldn't do. He also told them that when Mr Gunyen realised his mistake, he went to the boy and apologized. This entire issue has been investigated by the Board. So, the best person to ask this would the Board's Secretary. I have myself testified before the committees and my answering what they did or didn't would not be right
NDTV: You have been having a tough time all these days but what are your thoughts for the boy's death and about you being labelled the villain?
Principal: It's very sad. First of all, I would like the whole world to know about my grief for Rouvan's death. He was mischievous not wicked, he ran rings around us but as teachers we always knew that there will be boys who would always do that. All these issues were brought to the notice of the parents from time to time, including the letter that I could hand over to you. Having said that had there been any guy I would have grieved this much, I am deeply saddened and I grieve for that boy. He continues to be in our presence even today. It's sad to hear that my picture is painted as that of a villain because I have stood by everything and did my best for this school. And then to be told that I am running some sort of a den here without actually verifying really hurts. Yes it hurts. I won't say I am depressed but I am tired of all these allegations that have been coming continuously. But whatever I have said today is the truth and this can be verified with anyone you have spoken to or will speak to and let's see if there are any changes in the statements that I have made.
NDTV: Because of this incident the school is dragged into, a lot of people are disappointed. Have you thought of putting in your papers even once? The Board has not decided to suspend you?
Principal: I am deeply grieved by what has happened to my school and the kind of coverage that is going on. It is a trial by media. We have been castigated and called all sorts of names, horrific adjectives. We keep quiet because we needed to maintain a dignified silence but now we are being forced to speak up because it's been said that the school is not answering. I need to tell that this is the truth. And your second question... what was it?
NDTV: Have you thought of putting in your papers?
Principal: For what reasons? Just because I caned the boy and for which I have even apologised and have been punished. Should I resign? I haven't thought about that.
NDTV: Thank you!
Here is the transcript of Chakravathi's interview to NDTV.
NDTV: For the first time since the death of Rouvan Rawla on February12, the Principal of La Martiniere Boys, is speaking to the media. The principal and three, maybe four teachers of the school, now have a case filed against them. The police have acquitted them of abetting Rovan suicide. Mr Chakravarty, thank you so much for speaking to us. Just to go back on the 12th, what did you rebuke Rouvanjit for?
Principal: Well I would like to change that word ... I did not rebuke him... he was guilty of bringing and setting off stink bombs in the class before the teacher arrived, and was again attempting to do so when the teacher was teaching. He was told in very clear terms that he would have to take a note signed by the Middle School Head asking his father to see me on Monday the 15th.
NDTV: Four days before that, on February 8, you caned Rouvan. Why was that? And is it true that the cane broke on his back?
Principal: What is true is that on Monday the 8th, I caned not just Rouvan but two other boys who were playing throughout and it is true that I used two mild strokes of cane. Two mild strokes. It is a horrendous and outrageous lie to say that the cane broke. That is a figment of I don't know whose imagination.
NDTV: Is it not something that you have admitted to in conversation with Ajay Rawla, the father?
Principal: What I have said is that it is an old cane which is frayed at the edges. That is what I have said. I have not said that the cane broke into two pieces. Now it is alleged that it broke into several pieces and that is wrong.
NDTV: That brings us to the whole principle of caning and corporal punishment. Is it true that caning is rampant in school? Where do you stand on corporal punishment?
Principal: There are two issues involved here - to say that caning is rampant in La Martiniere School is not correct. I am very clear with my teachers that nobody should hit them. If I have ever caned a guy, I have done it on the rarest of occasions and it has been mild caning to tell them clearly how disappointed the Principal is. They have never ever been caned with an intention to hurt. La Mart firmly believes that we need to correct children and we need to punish them in a fair manner, in a compassionate way. Now the second part of the question about where I stand in relation to corporal punishment, I have to admit that when I caned this boy I made a mistake and I am willing and ready to face the consequences of that. But to link this particularly with the caning that happened on Monday the 8th with the death of the boy four to five days later, I think is stretching it a bit.
NDTV: This is the first time that you admit that it was a mistake to cane Rouvanjit. Why are you saying that now?
Principal: I am surprised that you are saying that this is the first time. I have been questioned by my Board and I have said that to my Board. I don't think that I am answerable to anybody else. Not only have I admitted it to the Board, I have apologized for my mistake and I have been rapped on my knuckles for that. Now what?
NDTV: But why do you think it's a mistake? You clearly don't think that a corrective action is necessary.
Principal: Corrective action is necessary but now as I am being told, day in and day out, that caning is not a correct form of punishment. Then I have to admit that it was a mistake.
NDTV: So were you not aware that caning is now illegal?
Principal: I knew that caning was not approved of and was illegal but I must admit I wasn't too sure of that. But I am aware now that it was wrong.
NDTV:So are you saying that from now on there will be no more caning in La Martiniere?
Principal: Maa'm all I can say to you is that I have received an admonition from the Board and I have given not only my apologies for what has happened but I have also very clearly stated that this will not be repeated. And as far as the cane is concerned, it is in the school archives now.
NDTV: And that must come as very good news for the La Martiniere boys. But in the meanwhile, you have a police case that charges you and 4 other teachers of abetting Rouvan for suicide. How do you handle that?
Principal: See Maa'm, the allegations have been made and they have to be proven. There has to be a connection between what happened on Monday and what happened on Tuesday. I deny that there is any truth in this but it is for the concerned authorities and departments to find any link. As far as I am concerned, there was no link.
NDTV: Finally, one thing that Ajay Rawla has said is that ever since Rouvan's death, he has written to the Board and he has tried to get some response it but there hasn't been any. And you have told us about the apology to the Board but have you ever thought about apologising to the father of the boy?
Principal: If I have to apologise to Mr Rawla I would do it but why would I do so? (for caning his son).
NDTV: Would you consider an apology to Mr Ajay Rawla?
Principal: It is being said that none of us called the family after the death, but on the day of the chautha, when the memorial was being held in the house, my Vice Principal, my Head of Juniors, my Head of Middle Section and myself, we all went to the family and offered our condolences to the family. We grieved with them and on the following day, during the Junior Sports Meet, we observed two minute silence. On Monday, we held a memorial service for him in school because he was so close to us. We did what was never done for any other boy in school. So are we grieving? Are we sorry for this death? Of course we are but I am actually mystified about what has caused this? What is it that made Rouvan to do what he did??
NDTV: Are you sure it was not the caning and humiliation by you or 3 or 4 other teachers?
Principal: Maa'm there is no case for humiliation and I and don't think that the caning which took place 4 days ago can be connected to this. And if a boy sets off a stink bomb is the class, you tell me what is a teacher expected to do? This teacher did the right thing, which is to go and report to the Middle Section. The Middle Section comes back, investigates, and interrogates the boys. So, where is the humiliation? Now, if the other boys point fingers at him and if that is what is regarded as humiliation, I wouldn't know. Is that what is being suggested? Because there was no humiliation.
NDTV: The boy was kept out of class for days on end, some say he was being slapped. All this put together -, not just between 8th of February and 12th of February, not just what you did- are you investigating all that? Are you looking into all that? Are you looking into the possibility that the boy, as it is claimed, was victimised?
Principal: Soon after Rouvan's death, the Bishop instituted a fact finding enquiry and this committee went into all the aspects of these allegations. Let me tell you when Mr Rawla met me, he introduced 2 new allegations - one is that his son was kept out of class for days and that Mr Gunyen had slapped his boy 2 or 3 years ago for whistling, which his son couldn't do. He also told them that when Mr Gunyen realised his mistake, he went to the boy and apologized. This entire issue has been investigated by the Board. So, the best person to ask this would the Board's Secretary. I have myself testified before the committees and my answering what they did or didn't would not be right
NDTV: You have been having a tough time all these days but what are your thoughts for the boy's death and about you being labelled the villain?
Principal: It's very sad. First of all, I would like the whole world to know about my grief for Rouvan's death. He was mischievous not wicked, he ran rings around us but as teachers we always knew that there will be boys who would always do that. All these issues were brought to the notice of the parents from time to time, including the letter that I could hand over to you. Having said that had there been any guy I would have grieved this much, I am deeply saddened and I grieve for that boy. He continues to be in our presence even today. It's sad to hear that my picture is painted as that of a villain because I have stood by everything and did my best for this school. And then to be told that I am running some sort of a den here without actually verifying really hurts. Yes it hurts. I won't say I am depressed but I am tired of all these allegations that have been coming continuously. But whatever I have said today is the truth and this can be verified with anyone you have spoken to or will speak to and let's see if there are any changes in the statements that I have made.
NDTV: Because of this incident the school is dragged into, a lot of people are disappointed. Have you thought of putting in your papers even once? The Board has not decided to suspend you?
Principal: I am deeply grieved by what has happened to my school and the kind of coverage that is going on. It is a trial by media. We have been castigated and called all sorts of names, horrific adjectives. We keep quiet because we needed to maintain a dignified silence but now we are being forced to speak up because it's been said that the school is not answering. I need to tell that this is the truth. And your second question... what was it?
NDTV: Have you thought of putting in your papers?
Principal: For what reasons? Just because I caned the boy and for which I have even apologised and have been punished. Should I resign? I haven't thought about that.
NDTV: Thank you!
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